Mossms eating in cryo? VS cost of boxes ect.
Here are the design goals:
- People shouldn't be able to use cryo to avoid feeding their pets long term
- Need to be able to easily sell mossms at low land impact
- There should be some kind of base price for mossms
- We don't want the market overflowing with mossms for nearly free.
Putting a price on the cryo pod solves all of those. We talked about having some kind of cooldown on cryo, like once a mossm is in cryo, she can't go back to cryo for a while. But that'd be annoying and inconvenient in a few ways.
Some people suggested the idea of making cryo free, but letting mossms still eat in cryo. That's a possibility, and I think it achieves all the goals.
I think that mossms should still not age in cryo, because babies are fun and it'd be a shame to only be able to buy full grown mossms.
Like I said in chat :-)
I think there should be two options of cryo.. The basic cryo that would still have the mossms eating and what not, but holds them still and yes stops the aging! Then the cryo for those who want to store mossms or what not that costs resources to purchase and stops everything on the mossm.
I think that making all cryo options cost resources would hinder the growth of said hobby breeder. I for one only having a few mossms out do not gain slk fast enough to sell a mossm on the market. When I gain slk I am looking forward to getting new items and or breeding. Which is slow but not annoyingly slow. If I had to save up even 1900 slk just to cryo my mossm for market I would be kind of put off by that. also if the basic cryo does not stop the mossms from eating it would slow the flooding of the market simply because you could only sell the number of mossms that you have food for.
That is just my two cents...
The 1900 slk was just an example I have no idea how much they are planning on charging :-P
I understand all the Goals , but i think the price is maybe to high.
1 Mossm generates 240 slk a Day and need to eat also that day.
So what if the price would be 240 slk . That way the Mossm need to be out and working for 24 hours also eating. Than also maybe possible to sell those boxes alternatively for 10 L$ , that more than the amount they eat for a day.
About the Base Price for a Mossm , Thats actually a great point. I will discuss that with Rob that we put it as a Market Rule for our Mossms Market.
Oki i did some testing with the cryo boxes.
First of all i would like to say the system works great and i like it a lot BUT.. this is a pretty big BUT :-)
I really do not like the system that you only can use them once.
I already understood this solution was because of the not eating of the mossms when they are in the cryo box
But with this solution you guys really working against the market of the mossms.
Their will become never big markets in it..
1 box is ca 2000slk. 1 mossm produce 240slk a day. 2000 / 240 = 8.33. So every 8 days you are able to buy 1 box.. that you will lose anyway..and what if you dont get it sold.. and you want to send it to space? or breed with it again? then you bought that box for nothing and also lost the slk for it.
So even the big breeders wont be able to sell mass with this system.
No Big market = No Market = No Big Breeders = Mossms will become pets in stead of a breedable game.
I see a few solutions in this
- Let the mossms eat while they are inside the box
- i heard also a great idea on the chat.. Make 2 different type of boxes. Type 1= free (mossms will eat when inside) Type 2=Not free (mossms will not eat when inside)
I like personally more the second option. it will solve everything.. The thing with mossms is.. that they dont work with eggs or bundles or whatever. So their must be a system to be able to keep your mossms inside your inventory and not let them to eat. But also need a system to be able to sell them. And option 2 take care of that.
Greetings Robin
Rob said:
1 box is ca 2000slk. 1 mossm produce 240slk a day. 2000 / 240 = 8.33. So every 8 days you are able to buy 1 box
Another way to do this math: DJ Rob has 113 mossms, which produce 10 resources per hour each. 1130 resources per hour means it takes 1 hour and 45 minutes for DJ rob to buy a cryo box.
I understand what you're saying though, just wanted to point out that there's not any actual waiting of 8 days involved.
You make great points though, and we're listening. We want to give more people a chance to share ideas then we'll see what we can do.
A couple of thoughts in response to Abbygail:
First and most important, we're listening and we will consider everyone's input on this topic. We will ultimately make a decision that makes the most sense based on your feedback and the goals Progenitor outlined above.
We created cryo as a method for reselling your critters. It was not designed to be a long term storage solution. But, what I think I'm hearing is that you may want such a thing. I have two theories on why you might want this:
1. Because a hobbyist can only keep a minimal number of mossms in world at a time.
2. Because a hobbyist may want to keep a mossm as a pet or collector item but no longer want to feed it.
For example; a hobbyist may want to collect all of the possible Mossm breeds but obviously won't be able feed them all. In this case we plan to provide a system where you can "retire" a mossm and keep it as a pet that will no longer consume food.
A hobbyist will also need the ability to put away Mossms that are no longer of value to them for one reason or another to make room for newer/cooler ones. Before we launch we will be provding a cash in service where you will be able to exchange your unwanted Mossms and get back a portion of their resource costs.
In these ways, we will be providing you with ways to keep Mossms you no longer want to feed and the ability to keep your herds as thin as you need while providing you with resource rewards for cashing them in.
Is there some other reason that we should be considering in which a hobbyist may want to keep a mossm frozen in a box for an extended period of time?
I would want to be able to keep a Mossm in a box for an extended period of time, If I was lucky enough to get two nice babies but both were girls and at that time I only had prims available for one girl, but I'd like to able to breed both at some point. espically with the family breeding limits. with live births too, you have to be sure you have prims to be able to keep the baby. Its very fine balancing act. The only other breedable I had that gave live births didn't last very long with me, cause for me feeding them and seeing what babys i could get was a big part of it, but with limited prims and funds, the need to feed the babies etc from the moment they were born made them very tricky for me, alot of the babies were sent away as soon as i saw them. being able to store those currently unwanted babies is important.
As for trying to stop the market from flooding and too many people dropping the prices of the mossm, even if you charged resources for a box, once its boxed and it doesn't sell peoples natural reaction is to reduce it till it does, espically with other people who may get the same one, looking at the price and marking theres lower. If they decide to leave they will just drop um to 10l , and thats just the way it is in second life and rl people will only pay for a breedable what they think its worth. I think Im waffling now.
well i think if it is a baby, i wouldn't mind a means to freeze the baby til i could breed it, without need of worry of them needing food for them
there is a company that did that (good thing cause those bred likes rabbits o.o;) (babies only)
they also had a version that thought it froze stats, the animal would release really hungry... which is good and bad depending on who gets that crate (adults only)
Having spent some time considering the responses here I have some additional thoughts, based on your concerns, that I would love for you guys to ponder and provide some feedback on.
Zermit, Pebbles and Abbygail all seem to be alluding to the idea that there might be a time where the ability to freeze a very special Mossm baby for use at a later time when they have availability for it where they previously may not have. If we set aside the cost for a moment and talk strictly functionality, I'd suggest that the current functionality of the cryo pod provides exactly that… the ability to box up a special Mossm and freeze its growth and hunger for later use.
For most other breedables the babies are delivered already boxed up. After a while, users end up with stock piles of "common" boxed up babies that never get opened and never get sold because they carry no value on the secondary market. Sure, you can trade them in but there's no real incentive to do so. Mossms will be somewhat similar in that the ones that are perceived to be common will have little to no value on the secondary market. In either scenario, no one needs a back stock of (boxed up or alive) common creatures that they don't intend to use and cannot sell. I am nearly certain that there is no good argument for hanging on to boxed up common babies and similarly no good argument for boxing up your own common babies.
Rob and Sandy feel like the cost to freeze may hurt the secondary market. I'm not sure I agree and offer up the following counter argument: by now you've noticed that while you progress through the game you have some challenging decisions to make, especially in the early days, as you try to strike a balance between earning resources and making new babies. The introduction of the cryo pod actually throws another element of decision making into your game play making every choice you make a bit more meaningful. For example when a baby is born, a breeder will need to decide if the baby is worth investing in the cryo pod in order to resell it on the secondary market. If there is a cost associated with selling a user will be less inclined to sell "crap" which means the goods going to secondary market will be of higher value. In our model, a big breeder will need to focus on quality not quantity. If we leave cryo in place I envision a market where supply stays low, and demand stays high. If demand stays high the prices will stay high.
Lots of you, both here and in group chat, suggested having Mossms eat while in cryo as a possible solution. Initially I liked this idea but having thought about it over night I can see a potential problem. Here's why: using Rob's math above and our current pricing for the cryo pod it would take one Mossm 8 days to earn enough slack to buy the pod. Your Mossm that earned the slack was eating for those 8 days at a rate of L$6 per day for a total of L$48. That means it costs you L$48 to put your Mossm on the secondary market. Now, lets say that we didn't charge for cryo but did make the Mossm continue to eat and it took you 60 days to sell your Mossm on the secondary market. Your cost to sell the Mossm would be L$360. You can see how in this second example that it might cost you quite a bit of L$ to eventually sell a Mossm especially one that was of lower desire.
With all of that said, how would you guys feel if we lowered the price of cryo pod making it more obtainable for a hobbyist and permitting a breeder a few more usage opportunities?
I want you all to know that I perceive this discussion as a sharing of ideas not and not a defensive argument and you may be right. This may not be a good solution but I challenge you to think outside of the box a little when considering what we have so far and when offering up ideas for solutions. The breedable markets have been broken for years yet everyone who enters the space follows precisely the same model. They create their systems then the big breeders come in and blow it up in precisely the same way each time. The markets end up stale and people end up unhappy. It is my sincere hope that we can change the model and create a fun and profitable environment for everyone for a long time to come but to do that, we have to change it.
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March 22, 2013
11 years, 8 months ago
Should you be able to box your mossms at a cost of resources and they stop working ,eating ect. Or box your mossms and they stop eating and working? How wil that effect the larger breeders and will the cost be out of reach for the hobby breeders?